Knives Down: Inside the community fight against knife crime - Part 1

Our latest episode of Inside HMCTS delves into an impactful anti-knife crime event held at Westminster Magistrates’ Court earlier this month.

In the first of this two-part episode, we speak with Ian Rawlins, a Legal Adviser from London, about the inspiration behind the event and the importance of educating young people on the dangers of knife crime.

Listeners can expect to hear about the various activities and talks that were planned for the day, and find out more about a mock knife murder trial that students would be taking part in.

Listen now to learn more about the efforts to combat knife crime and the positive impact of community engagement.

The second instalment will be published soon, where we'll be hearing from some of those in attendance and again from Ian on how the event went on the day.

For full transcript of each episode, please visit - Inside HMCTS

Transcript

Aaron Wilson:  

Hello, and welcome to the latest episode of Inside HMCTS with me, Aaron Wilson, from the communications team. In today's episode, we're going to be looking back at an anti-knife crime event that we held earlier in October and focusing on some of the work that went into creating that day and the purpose behind it.  

There will be a second part to this episode, where we'll look back on how the event went and hear from some of our special guests who attended on the day. But prior to the event, I caught up with one of our excellent legal advisors, Ian, who filled me in on what the day was all about.  

So, Ian, thanks so much for joining me and taking time out of your busy schedule to come and have a chat about this event. 

I don't want to steal your thunder too much, so do you want to introduce yourself and your role here at HMCTS?  

Ian Rawlins: 

I'm Ian Rawlins. I'm a legal adviser at Central London area, which covers Westminster Magistrates' Court and City of London Magistrates' Court.  

Aaron Wilson: 

Could you tell me a bit more about what the purpose of the anti-knife crime event here at Westminster is? 

Ian Rawlins:  

Yeah. So, this is an idea I’ve had pre-COVID. It's unfortunate, there's no stranger to the fact that knife crime has increased dramatically throughout the years, and it's not going away. The stats are showing that things are increasing. 

We can see each and every day and week with the footfall of defendants charged with knife offences that are coming that have increased. And for me, I've been involved in youths, one way or another, helping or assisting them be it through football or through schoolwork, in being a school governor, being a football coach. And that's been my involvement with youths. So outside of the court environment was where my concern was rising. 

Having heard conversations in training with the kids in the background and having had an experience where, after a training session, a head teacher of a school turned up. And I could hear in the background that dad was there, and I heard the head teacher say, which one's Ian? And I turned and saw the dad pointing to me and the head teacher saying, okay, thanks.  

So, I thought, okay what's this all about? So, after the training session, I was sort of beckoned over and their teacher said, sorry, to disturb you. I wouldn't normally do this, but such is my concern for this particular player in terms of his outside work. So, although technically I could have said nothing to do with me, I'm just I'm just the coach and manager of this team, I don't extend to his personal life. I was curious to what she had to say because the dad also looked very concerned as well. 

And between the dad and the head teacher, they had said that this particular young man running with the wrong crowd, so much so that he was being used by some boys who were 2 or 3 grades younger than him to hold knives in his bedroom. And the dad had come across those knives. Turned out he was part of the gang. And for me, it was really concerning, because what it said to me was if it wasn't for football, he would be even more involved in this gang work. In my role with the courts, I think I thought, well, I can perhaps utilise my role with the court with people coming through the courts being charged with knives and with youngsters increasingly being caught with knives. 

For us to try and do something and to try and educate these kids of the dangers of carrying knives, not only being involved in gangs, but also being holder of a knife and ultimately using a knife or being a victim of someone else using a knife on them. So that was my inspiration to try and do something in the court side of things to get these kids in to help educate them. So, with that in mind, in passing one day, I saw Stephen McAllister, the head of legal operations, and just ran it through him briefly.  

I don't even think I need to finish the sentence straight away, Stephen said: “I'm in, let's do it.” And that's when things began to take its course. I was more than happy when we did manage to find our 2 schools who said straight away, we're in. So that helped me to give some hope for these kids. And moving forward, the idea is after Monday's event, then we'd like to plan more to invite other schools from other boroughs in because it's about the educational side. 

As far as the day is concerned, I want it to be a type of roller coaster ride for them. It's going to be informative. It's going to be enjoyable, but I also want it to be scary for them because I want them to understand the realities and consequences of carrying a knife. Not just to them, but to others that they know or to their loved ones and people connected to them. So that that's the idea of the day. 

Aaron Wilson:  

So it sounds like the day is going to be pretty full on. But can you tell me about who will be coming to the event?  

Ian Rawlins:  
 
People like, Steel Warriors are coming. Steel Warriors, their emphasis is on fitness. So, they like to go into prisons, and so they will go into a prison, and they will tell the prisoners it doesn't just end here because you're inside, there is still more that you can do for yourself, and they give them that hope.  

They also, with the youngsters, teach them about the physical attributes of life. So, it's no secret that if you occupy your time, then you're busy doing something. When you're idle, that's when the youngsters can get side-tracked into the wrong things. 

So Steel Warriors, want to emphasise the fact of being energetic, going out there, and really enjoying life and putting more in life through fitness and hope. So they, are fortunate enough to be working with companies where we, the courts and police, confiscate knives through proceedings. They will melt down those knives, and they will create outdoor fitness equipment.  

On the day itself, they'll be giving a talk. They'll be showing 1 or 2 short videos, but they'll also be doing some callisthenic exercises with the kids just to show them the different types of things that they can be doing and progressing of exercises.  

You've then got the Street Doctors. The Street Doctors will be showing the 7 steps to save a life. What they've said is even if the kids remember 2 or 3 of those steps, it will go a long way in helping someone. The theme of the day is ‘caught to court’. So caught in the street to a court house. 

So that's why the idea is to start the ball rolling, the Met Police should be talking about what happens when they come across a suspect in the street, the steps they take if someone's given a caution or charge, or if they then look to CPS (Crown Prosecution Service) to make a decision about a charge.   

CPS will then be talking about what happens when they're approached by the police for a charging decision, the steps they take, and what they do when they bring cases to court.  

We've then got the Deputy Chief Magistrate for England and Wales, Tan Ikram, and he will be giving a talk about when things come to court, what the court does, what the court's powers are, what the judges do. 

And we've got, Fadi Daoud from Lawrence and Co solicitors. He will be talking about what happens when someone is charged and when they come to them for advice and what type of things they will say to a client who's been charged and what to prepare for.  

We've got the Ben Kinsella Trust attending. For those of you that don't know about Ben Kinsella Trust, Ben Kinsella was unfortunately a victim of a stabbing and he lost his life. So his dad set up Ben Kinsella Trust to try and help the youngsters and guide them as well.  

We then got the Sheriff of London coming. She'll be giving a little insight about what she does and any work that she does with the youth.   

Aaron Wilson:  

So this event is, you know, clearly designed to discourage, use of knives and tackle knife crime, but what can students expect on the day, and what will they be doing at the event itself?  

Ian Rawlins:  

In the afternoon, we're culminating with the mock multi-hander knife murder trial.  

Every one of those students will have an active role to play in the mock trial and the mock trial is an actual real life trial that took place at the Crown Court. The kids don't know that yet, but it's a real life trial, obviously we're condensing that into an hour and a half.  

Aaron Wilson:  

I mean, it seems like it's going to be pretty busy with, with attendees on the day, but can you tell me about the special guests that we're also expecting on the day?  

Ian Rawlins:  

We're fortunate enough as well, as you guys know, that we're also going to be having Heidi Alexander, the government minister attending, which is an excellent thing. So, she'll be able to give a quick chat to everyone in the afternoon and I've got an ex-player of mine who is now a professional player for Charlton Athletic, Kane Ramsey. He's agreed to attend as soon as he's finished his training session, in the morning, and he'll be hopefully arriving around lunchtime. 

So, he'll be able to have a chat with the kids if they want to talk about things and a little sort of inspiration for them that if they do have a goal and they can see it through, then you can achieve things.  

So yes, so at the end of it, the idea is, we'll be awarding the kids a certificate of attendance. It's just a little something for us to say thank you and it's something for them to put in their portfolio. We're going to give the schools a certificate each as well to say thank you for attending our event. 

And that and that is the day really.   

Aaron Wilson:   

So, Ian, thanks so much for joining me today. And we're really looking forward to seeing all the hard work that you've put in come to fruition at the event.  

For our listeners, there'll obviously be a part 2 to this episode. We'll be hearing from some of the guests that Ian has mentioned as well, and then we'll catch up with Ian as well to see how the event went on the day. 

So, stay tuned, and we'll be releasing that episode very soon.